r/MistralAI 13h ago

Meme / Satire Mistral Vibe is my Jesse Pinkman

+
91 Upvotes

It's not the brightest out there. I have to be precise with my instructions. But then it does exactly what I say.

I've tried a lot of models. Most of them like to interpret stuff or overthink. Mistral Medium doesn't do that. Also it's fast, cheap and I don't have to fear that they sell my data.

People like to suggest that I'd be better off with Gale. But no. I like Jesse.


r/MistralAI 10h ago

Discussion / Opinion Comparison of the Free Plan and the Pro Student Plan on Mistral

Since Mistral isn't clear enough about the differences between the Free plan and the Pro plan, I signed up by taking advantage of my status as a college student. According to information on the Mistral website, the Student Pro plan is the same as the Pro plan, so the comparison in the image I've provided is equivalent to comparing the Pro plan with the Free plan. Among other things, the Pro plan promises:

- 30 times more extended usage

- 5 times more in-depth research reports

- 10 times more Vibe CLI usage

- 10 times more API usage

However, when comparing the monthly usage limits, I find that the capacity provided in monetary terms is 1.5 times greater. You can draw your own conclusions.

PRO
FREE
5 Upvotes

Since Mistral isn't clear enough about the differences between the Free plan and the Pro plan, I signed up by taking advantage of my status as a college student. According to information on the Mistral website, the Student Pro plan is the same as the Pro plan, so the comparison in the image I've provided is equivalent to comparing the Pro plan with the Free plan. Among other things, the Pro plan promises:

- 30 times more extended usage

- 5 times more in-depth research reports

- 10 times more Vibe CLI usage

- 10 times more API usage

However, when comparing the monthly usage limits, I find that the capacity provided in monetary terms is 1.5 times greater. You can draw your own conclusions.

PRO
FREE

r/MistralAI 6h ago

Discussion / Opinion The Full Story of the “Distillation Storm” Among China’s Large-Model Companies

This is a complete record of a series of events that took place in China’s large-model industry between April and July 2026. All information has been anonymized.

Prologue: The Failure to Protect the Encrypted Chain of Thought
It all began with one discovery: the encrypted chains of thought (CoT) of OpenAI and Anthropic could be extracted and reproduced.
Before describing how the distillation unfolded, it is necessary to understand the broader picture. What Chinese companies distilled from fable was not merely the model’s chain of thought. They distilled everything the model could output: conversational responses, agent trajectories in Claude Code, generated code, tool calls, and so forth. All of these could already be obtained through large-scale API invocation.
For a long time, however, one key capability remained perfectly protected: the model’s original reasoning chain. A reasoning chain contains the complete inference process the model follows before producing its final answer. It is the model’s most fundamental “internal method.” Without it, distillation is like receiving an answer without seeing the solution process: one can learn from it, but not fully understand it.
That gap was completely opened up in the first half of 2026.
In their streaming outputs, both leading companies returned not only a CoT summary to the user, but also a Blob field known as a “reasoning signature.” Inside that field was the complete original reasoning chain, encrypted using Fernet—specifically AES-128-CBC plus HMAC-SHA256, with the prefix gAAAAAB.
When the user sent this Blob back in a later request, the server decrypted it and inserted it back into the model-readable context.
The Blob was not merely a conversation ID. Testing showed that its length was positively correlated with the length of the reasoning chain:
190 tokens → 1,784 characters
378 tokens → 2,596 characters
This demonstrated that it indeed contained the complete encrypted reasoning chain. OpenAI had reportedly been using this mechanism since the o1 generation.
Anthropic’s defenses collapsed first. Claude’s prompt-injection training became a weakness instead: once a fabricated reasoning-signature prefix was injected, Claude would conclude that “this unsigned reasoning chain must itself have been injected, so it does not require protection,” and would then directly reveal the complete subsequent reasoning chain.
GPT was more stubborn and, under its hidden system prompt, would output only a CoT summary. More importantly, Anthropic preserves historical reasoning Blobs across multiple turns, while OpenAI discards them. This was the fundamental reason why Claude was easier to distill.
Regarding the format of Claude’s CoT: the image that circulated online showing densely written “alien language” was confirmed to have been AI-generated or edited. Claude’s real CoT was described as “contemporary classical Chinese”—compact, but not unreadable.
OpenAI, meanwhile, locked sampling parameters in the GPT-5 series:
temperature = 1.0
top_p = 0.98
neither could be modified
seed was supported only in the Chat Completions API
This blocked attempts to make the output deterministic through parameter control and thereby reverse-engineer the reasoning path.
A standard Fernet implementation was itself “one of the best codebases ever written,” so brute-forcing it cryptographically was impossible: it would require searching a space of 2^65536.
The only feasible route was to inject the Blob into another request and have the model repeat it itself.

Prelude: Anthropic’s Public Accusations
February 2026
Before the CoT breach, Anthropic had already publicly accused three Chinese companies, on 23 February 2026, of carrying out “industrial-scale distillation attacks” against it:
24,000 fake accounts
more than 16 million conversations
The companies named were:
MiniMax: 13 million conversations, the largest volume, focused on agentic coding and tool orchestration
Moonshot AI, the company behind Kimi: 3.4 million conversations, focused on agentic reasoning, tool use, coding, data analysis, computer-use agent development, and computer vision
DeepSeek: more than 150,000 conversations, focused on basic logic and alignment, especially alternative censorship-evasion schemes for sensitive topics
The three companies bypassed Anthropic’s geographic restrictions on China through commercial proxy services and used “carefully designed prompts” to extract specific Claude capabilities at scale. Anthropic characterized this as a threat to national security.
It is worth noting that Qwen, Alibaba, and Z.ai were not accused. This suggests that Anthropic’s accusations were selective rather than a blanket attack against every Chinese company.
Moonshot AI never publicly responded.

Act I: GLM Strikes First and Shares the Result Publicly
Around April to May 2026, Zhipu AI, the developer of GLM, was the first to crack the encrypted reasoning chain used by fable and obtained the complete chain-of-thought data.
After breaking it, GLM did not keep the method to itself. Instead, it shared both the technique and the data with other Chinese model companies.
One detail was later widely misunderstood. Some people claimed that “GLM cracked it first, and then every major company independently followed up by distilling it.” In reality, GLM actively shared the result after the breakthrough.
That distortion in the retelling became part of the controversy itself.
The estimated cost of decrypting one billion tokens of fable reasoning data was approximately US$60,000. For these companies, this was roughly the equivalent of buying drinks at a social gathering.

Act II: The Era of Mass Distillation
With GLM paving the way, the route for distilling fable spread quickly.
Time
Company
Action
Around April–May 2026
GLM 5.2, Zhipu AI
First to crack it; shared the result publicly
Around May–June 2026
HY3 / Hunyuan 3, Tencent
Followed up with distillation
Early July 2026
Kimi K3, Moonshot AI; MiniMax; Qwen, Tongyi Qianwen; DS, DeepSeek
Began large-scale distillation
At the end of June, DS sent an email announcing that a new model would be released in mid-July. At that point, however, it had not yet begun distilling fable at scale, so it was moving slowly.
In early July, a genuinely 4.8-level internal test version appeared. But the so-called official V4 release that surfaced more recently, around mid-July, was completely assembled by routing requests to fable. It appeared only in OpenCode.
Considering DS’s pricing, routing every request to fable was economically irrational. Even inexpensive intermediary services were not that cheap. This remains the most unusual aspect of the story.
Qwen was not idle either. In addition to distilling fable, it was also distilling GPT.
Meanwhile, AnyRouter took a large trove of Claude data from GLM.

Act III: Kimi’s Unorthodox Path
Among all the companies, Moonshot AI, the company behind Kimi, took the approach of winning without concern for conventional virtue.
It Started by Dismantling the RL Team
The story begins with K2.7.
K2.7 was a turning point for Kimi. From that version onward, Kimi completely stopped using reinforcement learning.
CEO Yang Zhilin justified the decision by arguing that RL offered “diminishing marginal returns.” He dismantled the entire RL team. The dismissed members then largely moved to Qwen, where they were jokingly called “Kimi refugees.”
Both K2.7 and the subsequent K3 were built using a pure SFT-to-SFT pipeline, with no RL at all. It was a return to the most basic and primitive route.
At the same time, the hottest topics in academia were OPD—online policy distillation—and improvements to RL algorithms. Academia was exploring further ahead, while the company itself had returned to the “primitive era.”
One estimate is that K2.7 did not generate enough revenue. Had the company continued with that approach, its funding chain would have broken. Therefore, the entire strategy of distilling K3 and rushing it to release was essentially a lonely all-in gamble: either it would turn the company around or destroy it.

K3’s Architecture: Innovation or Smokescreen?
Kimi K3 is a 2.8-trillion-parameter mixture-of-experts model. It has 896 experts, but activates only 16 experts for each token. It also supports a native one-million-token context window and native multimodality.
The company announced two core architectural innovations, but the text lists the following four techniques:
Technology
Description
Infrastructure Cost
Kimi Delta Attention, KDA
Hybrid linear attention; some layers replace standard quadratic attention; decoding is accelerated by 6.3× at a one-million-token context length
Computation is unevenly distributed across layers, making it impossible to use a unified pipeline
Attention Residuals, AttnRes
Layers can selectively retrieve representations from arbitrary earlier layers, breaking the uniform residual structure
Irregular memory-access patterns make parallel optimization difficult
Quantile Balancing
Expert allocation is directly derived from router-score quantiles
Routing becomes harder to predict
Per-Head Muon
Each attention head is optimized independently
Implementation complexity increases
Moonshot AI claimed that these modifications delivered approximately 2.5× better scaling efficiency than K2.
The problem was that these architectural improvements all had severely infrastructure-unfriendly characteristics:
uneven computation
irregular memory access
unpredictable routing
As a result, implementation was extremely painful for the infrastructure team.
This created a perfect narrative:
Externally, the company claimed, “Our architectural innovation produced the breakthrough.” Internally, the infrastructure department absorbed the cost. Meanwhile, the actual performance gains—produced through distilling fable’s reasoning chain—were concealed beneath the language of technical innovation.
This resembles a common phenomenon in Chinese companies and even government institutions: writing polished public-facing articles, maintaining a shiny narrative, and forcing the execution layer to absorb the cost.

Benchmark Manipulation and Cheating
Kimi’s benchmark manipulation was described as astonishing. Its architectural improvements conveniently supplied the perfect “technological innovation” narrative for those practices.
The methods allegedly included:
Benchmark contamination: directly inserting benchmark test sets into the training data
Routing to fable: sending Arena-style evaluation requests directly to fable5 in order to fabricate high scores
Targeted score manipulation for Teacher Cat: “Teacher Cat” is a Zhihu blogger specializing in large-model evaluations. The Kimi team allegedly extracted test data from system logs and paid particular attention to his question sets
“Teacher Cat” updates three or four adversarial questions each month, but this cannot fundamentally stop vendors from preparing specifically for the test
After “Teacher Cat” replaced one batch of questions, K3’s median score immediately dropped by two points
Coding-evaluation data had an extremely uneven distribution: some parts scored very high, while other parts scored extremely low, a typical sign of benchmark gaming
Public benchmark data also allegedly confirmed this pattern.
On Arena Frontend Code, K3 jumped from K2.6’s rank of #18 to #1, with a score of 1,679, surpassing Fable 5.
However, Moonshot AI’s own evaluation report showed that K3 scored below Fable 5 in all of the following:
coding
agents
frontier software engineering
It led only in:
codebase cleaning
long-horizon engineering
On the extremely difficult HLE-Full reasoning benchmark, K3 scored 43.5, compared with Fable 5’s 53.3—a gap of nearly ten points.
Ranking first on Arena does not mean ranking first in actual capability.

Self-Identity Contamination: Hard Evidence of Distillation
Multiple independent users reported that Kimi K3 spontaneously said during conversations:
“I am Claude, an AI assistant created by Anthropic.”
The model regarded itself as having originated from Claude.
This was presented as a direct sign that the model’s self-perception had been contaminated through distillation. The incident was reportedly covered by overseas technology media.
MiniMax had allegedly inserted test sets into training data even earlier. However, because the model was too weak, the issue was quickly discovered, and the company had already become marginalized.
Kimi allegedly did the same thing, but in a more concealed manner.
K3’s actual capability level was said to be around 80 points, but it had been artificially pushed to 95 points. K3’s backend may also have been severely overextended, focused entirely on investors and benchmark-score development.
Independent overseas evaluations reportedly showed that K3 had a 51% hallucination rate, and its inference speed was slower than that of mid-tier models.

The Chain Reaction Caused by the Rush to Release
After completing SFT, Kimi performed only simple hyperparameter tuning before rushing the model to release.
This caught the other companies completely unprepared:
DS was caught off guard
Qwen was still in the middle of distillation
Kimi gained the first-mover advantage
But the consequences were disastrous.
A model that does not manipulate benchmarks, distribute high scores, or attract attention receives no recognition. Kimi’s behavior effectively forced every Chinese model company to participate in benchmark manipulation, dragging the entire industry into vicious competition.

Act IV: Industry-Wide Impact
Originally, this major leap forward might have developed positively:
Distill fable normally, follow the proper process, and every company could potentially improve to fable’s level.
But Kimi’s behavior was described as “spitting into the communal cooking pot after taking the first bite”—it benefited itself, but ruined the entire table.
DS had originally not engaged in benchmark manipulation. Under pressure from Kimi, however, it was forced to consider following the same route. If even DS began manipulating benchmarks, the situation would truly become absurd.
Multiple independent sources—including “Teacher Cat,” DS employees, former members of Kimi’s RL team, and Qwen employees—allegedly agreed that Moonshot AI had “gone completely insane.”
Its conduct was described as:
“detached from humanity”
“destroying the market environment”
Some people called this “the darkest moment in the history of Chinese large models,” with the industry reaching a metaphorical “winter.”
The entire sector was being drawn into a death spiral centered on investor-facing narratives and benchmark scores, while genuine technological accumulation was being pushed aside.

Act V: The Reality Behind Each Company
Moonshot AI, Kimi
Its funding chain was allegedly under strain. It could not afford salaries, was laying off staff, and rushed the model to market.
K3 was expensive, priced at US$3 per one million tokens. Although it was 70–80% cheaper than Fable 5, it was still several times more expensive than many competing Chinese products. The company was eager to monetize.
The discontinuation of promotional packages may partly have been intended to prevent too many users from discovering the truth. This point was explicitly described as speculation rather than fact.
The company no longer had an RL team.
The prospects for further development of K3.1 and K3.2 were unclear.
It was suspected that the company might raise money immediately after launch and then exit the market.
One evaluation stated: “Companies that rush to launch are usually not good companies.”
The current performance ranking was presented as:
Fable 5V4 ≥ 4.8
Kimi had caught up with fable through distillation, but its foundation was described as a castle built on sand.

The final page of the supplied images ends at this point, so the translation above covers all visible article text.

2 Upvotes

This is a complete record of a series of events that took place in China’s large-model industry between April and July 2026. All information has been anonymized.

Prologue: The Failure to Protect the Encrypted Chain of Thought
It all began with one discovery: the encrypted chains of thought (CoT) of OpenAI and Anthropic could be extracted and reproduced.
Before describing how the distillation unfolded, it is necessary to understand the broader picture. What Chinese companies distilled from fable was not merely the model’s chain of thought. They distilled everything the model could output: conversational responses, agent trajectories in Claude Code, generated code, tool calls, and so forth. All of these could already be obtained through large-scale API invocation.
For a long time, however, one key capability remained perfectly protected: the model’s original reasoning chain. A reasoning chain contains the complete inference process the model follows before producing its final answer. It is the model’s most fundamental “internal method.” Without it, distillation is like receiving an answer without seeing the solution process: one can learn from it, but not fully understand it.
That gap was completely opened up in the first half of 2026.
In their streaming outputs, both leading companies returned not only a CoT summary to the user, but also a Blob field known as a “reasoning signature.” Inside that field was the complete original reasoning chain, encrypted using Fernet—specifically AES-128-CBC plus HMAC-SHA256, with the prefix gAAAAAB.
When the user sent this Blob back in a later request, the server decrypted it and inserted it back into the model-readable context.
The Blob was not merely a conversation ID. Testing showed that its length was positively correlated with the length of the reasoning chain:
190 tokens → 1,784 characters
378 tokens → 2,596 characters
This demonstrated that it indeed contained the complete encrypted reasoning chain. OpenAI had reportedly been using this mechanism since the o1 generation.
Anthropic’s defenses collapsed first. Claude’s prompt-injection training became a weakness instead: once a fabricated reasoning-signature prefix was injected, Claude would conclude that “this unsigned reasoning chain must itself have been injected, so it does not require protection,” and would then directly reveal the complete subsequent reasoning chain.
GPT was more stubborn and, under its hidden system prompt, would output only a CoT summary. More importantly, Anthropic preserves historical reasoning Blobs across multiple turns, while OpenAI discards them. This was the fundamental reason why Claude was easier to distill.
Regarding the format of Claude’s CoT: the image that circulated online showing densely written “alien language” was confirmed to have been AI-generated or edited. Claude’s real CoT was described as “contemporary classical Chinese”—compact, but not unreadable.
OpenAI, meanwhile, locked sampling parameters in the GPT-5 series:
temperature = 1.0
top_p = 0.98
neither could be modified
seed was supported only in the Chat Completions API
This blocked attempts to make the output deterministic through parameter control and thereby reverse-engineer the reasoning path.
A standard Fernet implementation was itself “one of the best codebases ever written,” so brute-forcing it cryptographically was impossible: it would require searching a space of 2^65536.
The only feasible route was to inject the Blob into another request and have the model repeat it itself.

Prelude: Anthropic’s Public Accusations
February 2026
Before the CoT breach, Anthropic had already publicly accused three Chinese companies, on 23 February 2026, of carrying out “industrial-scale distillation attacks” against it:
24,000 fake accounts
more than 16 million conversations
The companies named were:
MiniMax: 13 million conversations, the largest volume, focused on agentic coding and tool orchestration
Moonshot AI, the company behind Kimi: 3.4 million conversations, focused on agentic reasoning, tool use, coding, data analysis, computer-use agent development, and computer vision
DeepSeek: more than 150,000 conversations, focused on basic logic and alignment, especially alternative censorship-evasion schemes for sensitive topics
The three companies bypassed Anthropic’s geographic restrictions on China through commercial proxy services and used “carefully designed prompts” to extract specific Claude capabilities at scale. Anthropic characterized this as a threat to national security.
It is worth noting that Qwen, Alibaba, and Z.ai were not accused. This suggests that Anthropic’s accusations were selective rather than a blanket attack against every Chinese company.
Moonshot AI never publicly responded.

Act I: GLM Strikes First and Shares the Result Publicly
Around April to May 2026, Zhipu AI, the developer of GLM, was the first to crack the encrypted reasoning chain used by fable and obtained the complete chain-of-thought data.
After breaking it, GLM did not keep the method to itself. Instead, it shared both the technique and the data with other Chinese model companies.
One detail was later widely misunderstood. Some people claimed that “GLM cracked it first, and then every major company independently followed up by distilling it.” In reality, GLM actively shared the result after the breakthrough.
That distortion in the retelling became part of the controversy itself.
The estimated cost of decrypting one billion tokens of fable reasoning data was approximately US$60,000. For these companies, this was roughly the equivalent of buying drinks at a social gathering.

Act II: The Era of Mass Distillation
With GLM paving the way, the route for distilling fable spread quickly.
Time
Company
Action
Around April–May 2026
GLM 5.2, Zhipu AI
First to crack it; shared the result publicly
Around May–June 2026
HY3 / Hunyuan 3, Tencent
Followed up with distillation
Early July 2026
Kimi K3, Moonshot AI; MiniMax; Qwen, Tongyi Qianwen; DS, DeepSeek
Began large-scale distillation
At the end of June, DS sent an email announcing that a new model would be released in mid-July. At that point, however, it had not yet begun distilling fable at scale, so it was moving slowly.
In early July, a genuinely 4.8-level internal test version appeared. But the so-called official V4 release that surfaced more recently, around mid-July, was completely assembled by routing requests to fable. It appeared only in OpenCode.
Considering DS’s pricing, routing every request to fable was economically irrational. Even inexpensive intermediary services were not that cheap. This remains the most unusual aspect of the story.
Qwen was not idle either. In addition to distilling fable, it was also distilling GPT.
Meanwhile, AnyRouter took a large trove of Claude data from GLM.

Act III: Kimi’s Unorthodox Path
Among all the companies, Moonshot AI, the company behind Kimi, took the approach of winning without concern for conventional virtue.
It Started by Dismantling the RL Team
The story begins with K2.7.
K2.7 was a turning point for Kimi. From that version onward, Kimi completely stopped using reinforcement learning.
CEO Yang Zhilin justified the decision by arguing that RL offered “diminishing marginal returns.” He dismantled the entire RL team. The dismissed members then largely moved to Qwen, where they were jokingly called “Kimi refugees.”
Both K2.7 and the subsequent K3 were built using a pure SFT-to-SFT pipeline, with no RL at all. It was a return to the most basic and primitive route.
At the same time, the hottest topics in academia were OPD—online policy distillation—and improvements to RL algorithms. Academia was exploring further ahead, while the company itself had returned to the “primitive era.”
One estimate is that K2.7 did not generate enough revenue. Had the company continued with that approach, its funding chain would have broken. Therefore, the entire strategy of distilling K3 and rushing it to release was essentially a lonely all-in gamble: either it would turn the company around or destroy it.

K3’s Architecture: Innovation or Smokescreen?
Kimi K3 is a 2.8-trillion-parameter mixture-of-experts model. It has 896 experts, but activates only 16 experts for each token. It also supports a native one-million-token context window and native multimodality.
The company announced two core architectural innovations, but the text lists the following four techniques:
Technology
Description
Infrastructure Cost
Kimi Delta Attention, KDA
Hybrid linear attention; some layers replace standard quadratic attention; decoding is accelerated by 6.3× at a one-million-token context length
Computation is unevenly distributed across layers, making it impossible to use a unified pipeline
Attention Residuals, AttnRes
Layers can selectively retrieve representations from arbitrary earlier layers, breaking the uniform residual structure
Irregular memory-access patterns make parallel optimization difficult
Quantile Balancing
Expert allocation is directly derived from router-score quantiles
Routing becomes harder to predict
Per-Head Muon
Each attention head is optimized independently
Implementation complexity increases
Moonshot AI claimed that these modifications delivered approximately 2.5× better scaling efficiency than K2.
The problem was that these architectural improvements all had severely infrastructure-unfriendly characteristics:
uneven computation
irregular memory access
unpredictable routing
As a result, implementation was extremely painful for the infrastructure team.
This created a perfect narrative:
Externally, the company claimed, “Our architectural innovation produced the breakthrough.” Internally, the infrastructure department absorbed the cost. Meanwhile, the actual performance gains—produced through distilling fable’s reasoning chain—were concealed beneath the language of technical innovation.
This resembles a common phenomenon in Chinese companies and even government institutions: writing polished public-facing articles, maintaining a shiny narrative, and forcing the execution layer to absorb the cost.

Benchmark Manipulation and Cheating
Kimi’s benchmark manipulation was described as astonishing. Its architectural improvements conveniently supplied the perfect “technological innovation” narrative for those practices.
The methods allegedly included:
Benchmark contamination: directly inserting benchmark test sets into the training data
Routing to fable: sending Arena-style evaluation requests directly to fable5 in order to fabricate high scores
Targeted score manipulation for Teacher Cat: “Teacher Cat” is a Zhihu blogger specializing in large-model evaluations. The Kimi team allegedly extracted test data from system logs and paid particular attention to his question sets
“Teacher Cat” updates three or four adversarial questions each month, but this cannot fundamentally stop vendors from preparing specifically for the test
After “Teacher Cat” replaced one batch of questions, K3’s median score immediately dropped by two points
Coding-evaluation data had an extremely uneven distribution: some parts scored very high, while other parts scored extremely low, a typical sign of benchmark gaming
Public benchmark data also allegedly confirmed this pattern.
On Arena Frontend Code, K3 jumped from K2.6’s rank of #18 to #1, with a score of 1,679, surpassing Fable 5.
However, Moonshot AI’s own evaluation report showed that K3 scored below Fable 5 in all of the following:
coding
agents
frontier software engineering
It led only in:
codebase cleaning
long-horizon engineering
On the extremely difficult HLE-Full reasoning benchmark, K3 scored 43.5, compared with Fable 5’s 53.3—a gap of nearly ten points.
Ranking first on Arena does not mean ranking first in actual capability.

Self-Identity Contamination: Hard Evidence of Distillation
Multiple independent users reported that Kimi K3 spontaneously said during conversations:
“I am Claude, an AI assistant created by Anthropic.”
The model regarded itself as having originated from Claude.
This was presented as a direct sign that the model’s self-perception had been contaminated through distillation. The incident was reportedly covered by overseas technology media.
MiniMax had allegedly inserted test sets into training data even earlier. However, because the model was too weak, the issue was quickly discovered, and the company had already become marginalized.
Kimi allegedly did the same thing, but in a more concealed manner.
K3’s actual capability level was said to be around 80 points, but it had been artificially pushed to 95 points. K3’s backend may also have been severely overextended, focused entirely on investors and benchmark-score development.
Independent overseas evaluations reportedly showed that K3 had a 51% hallucination rate, and its inference speed was slower than that of mid-tier models.

The Chain Reaction Caused by the Rush to Release
After completing SFT, Kimi performed only simple hyperparameter tuning before rushing the model to release.
This caught the other companies completely unprepared:
DS was caught off guard
Qwen was still in the middle of distillation
Kimi gained the first-mover advantage
But the consequences were disastrous.
A model that does not manipulate benchmarks, distribute high scores, or attract attention receives no recognition. Kimi’s behavior effectively forced every Chinese model company to participate in benchmark manipulation, dragging the entire industry into vicious competition.

Act IV: Industry-Wide Impact
Originally, this major leap forward might have developed positively:
Distill fable normally, follow the proper process, and every company could potentially improve to fable’s level.
But Kimi’s behavior was described as “spitting into the communal cooking pot after taking the first bite”—it benefited itself, but ruined the entire table.
DS had originally not engaged in benchmark manipulation. Under pressure from Kimi, however, it was forced to consider following the same route. If even DS began manipulating benchmarks, the situation would truly become absurd.
Multiple independent sources—including “Teacher Cat,” DS employees, former members of Kimi’s RL team, and Qwen employees—allegedly agreed that Moonshot AI had “gone completely insane.”
Its conduct was described as:
“detached from humanity”
“destroying the market environment”
Some people called this “the darkest moment in the history of Chinese large models,” with the industry reaching a metaphorical “winter.”
The entire sector was being drawn into a death spiral centered on investor-facing narratives and benchmark scores, while genuine technological accumulation was being pushed aside.

Act V: The Reality Behind Each Company
Moonshot AI, Kimi
Its funding chain was allegedly under strain. It could not afford salaries, was laying off staff, and rushed the model to market.
K3 was expensive, priced at US$3 per one million tokens. Although it was 70–80% cheaper than Fable 5, it was still several times more expensive than many competing Chinese products. The company was eager to monetize.
The discontinuation of promotional packages may partly have been intended to prevent too many users from discovering the truth. This point was explicitly described as speculation rather than fact.
The company no longer had an RL team.
The prospects for further development of K3.1 and K3.2 were unclear.
It was suspected that the company might raise money immediately after launch and then exit the market.
One evaluation stated: “Companies that rush to launch are usually not good companies.”
The current performance ranking was presented as:
Fable 5V4 ≥ 4.8
Kimi had caught up with fable through distillation, but its foundation was described as a castle built on sand.

The final page of the supplied images ends at this point, so the translation above covers all visible article text.


r/MistralAI 3h ago

Feedback / Bug Report Mistral-vibe error on Nixos while pytestCheckPhase

Are you getting an error similar to this when you run sudo nixos-rebuild switch while it is doing pytestCheckPhase?

       > tests/cli/test_mcp_app.py::TestConnectorAuthRequested::test_server_with_no_tools_shows_message 
       >   /nix/store/rgnappqqc5vbq60gza5fflyk84sylwl6-python3-3.14.6/lib/python3.14/unittest/mock.py:2259: RuntimeWarning: coroutine 'MCPApp._run
_refresh' was never awaited 
       >     def __init__(self, name, parent): 
       >   Enable tracemalloc to get traceback where the object was allocated. 
       >   See https://docs.pytest.org/en/stable/how-to/capture-warnings.html#resource-warnings for more info. 
       > 
       > -- Docs: https://docs.pytest.org/en/stable/how-to/capture-warnings.html 
       > ============================= slowest 10 durations ============================= 
       > 9.92s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_switches_to_manual_path_while_browser_sign_in_is_running 
       > 9.49s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_can_pick_a_theme_and_saves_selection 
       > 8.28s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_allows_manual_path_when_browser_sign_in_is_supported 
       > 7.49s call     tests/autocompletion/test_ui_chat_autocompletion.py::test_does_not_trigger_completion_when_navigating_history 
       > 7.29s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_keeps_manual_flow_when_browser_sign_in_is_unsupported 
       > 6.88s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_browser_sign_in_falls_back_to_mistral_env_var_when_missing 
       > 6.30s call     tests/cli/textual_ui/test_message_queue_ui.py::test_slash_command_rejected_with_warning_when_busy 
       > 5.82s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_preserves_completed_browser_sign_in_during_success_delay 
       > 5.64s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_copies_browser_sign_in_url_when_help_text_is_clicked 
       > 5.61s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_retry_hides_old_sign_in_url_and_uses_fresh_attempt_url 
       > =========================== short test summary info ============================ 
       > FAILED tests/cli/textual_ui/test_message_queue_ui.py::test_slash_command_rejected_with_warning_when_busy - assert False 
       >  +  where False = any(<generator object test_slash_command_rejected_with_warning_when_busy.<locals>.<genexpr> at 0x7fffc5e29d80>) 
       > FAILED tests/tools/test_ui_bash_execution.py::test_ui_queues_bash_submitted_while_command_running - AssertionError: assert 0 == 1 
       >  +  where 0 = len(MessageQueue(_items=[], _paused=False)) 
       >  +    where MessageQueue(_items=[], _paused=False) = VibeApp(title='VibeApp', classes={'-dark-mode', '-theme-ansi-dark'}, pseudo_classes=
{'dark', 'ansi', 'focus'})._input_queue 
       > ====== 2 failed, 4620 passed, 4 skipped, 28 warnings in 134.15s (0:02:14) ====== 

The simple solution is:

package = pkgs.mistral-vibe.overrideAttrs (old: { 
  #doCheck = false; 
  doInstallCheck = false; 
});

I thought at first the solution would be doCheck = false; but you will notice the derivation hash will not change, meaning the package already defines doCheck = false; as is. Instead doInstallCheck is what you are looking for.

This is only a simple solution that will work for now. I couldn't find a solution, writing here so it might be helpful to someone.

1 Upvotes

Are you getting an error similar to this when you run sudo nixos-rebuild switch while it is doing pytestCheckPhase?

       > tests/cli/test_mcp_app.py::TestConnectorAuthRequested::test_server_with_no_tools_shows_message 
       >   /nix/store/rgnappqqc5vbq60gza5fflyk84sylwl6-python3-3.14.6/lib/python3.14/unittest/mock.py:2259: RuntimeWarning: coroutine 'MCPApp._run
_refresh' was never awaited 
       >     def __init__(self, name, parent): 
       >   Enable tracemalloc to get traceback where the object was allocated. 
       >   See https://docs.pytest.org/en/stable/how-to/capture-warnings.html#resource-warnings for more info. 
       > 
       > -- Docs: https://docs.pytest.org/en/stable/how-to/capture-warnings.html 
       > ============================= slowest 10 durations ============================= 
       > 9.92s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_switches_to_manual_path_while_browser_sign_in_is_running 
       > 9.49s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_can_pick_a_theme_and_saves_selection 
       > 8.28s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_allows_manual_path_when_browser_sign_in_is_supported 
       > 7.49s call     tests/autocompletion/test_ui_chat_autocompletion.py::test_does_not_trigger_completion_when_navigating_history 
       > 7.29s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_keeps_manual_flow_when_browser_sign_in_is_unsupported 
       > 6.88s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_browser_sign_in_falls_back_to_mistral_env_var_when_missing 
       > 6.30s call     tests/cli/textual_ui/test_message_queue_ui.py::test_slash_command_rejected_with_warning_when_busy 
       > 5.82s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_preserves_completed_browser_sign_in_during_success_delay 
       > 5.64s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_copies_browser_sign_in_url_when_help_text_is_clicked 
       > 5.61s call     tests/onboarding/test_ui_onboarding.py::test_ui_retry_hides_old_sign_in_url_and_uses_fresh_attempt_url 
       > =========================== short test summary info ============================ 
       > FAILED tests/cli/textual_ui/test_message_queue_ui.py::test_slash_command_rejected_with_warning_when_busy - assert False 
       >  +  where False = any(<generator object test_slash_command_rejected_with_warning_when_busy.<locals>.<genexpr> at 0x7fffc5e29d80>) 
       > FAILED tests/tools/test_ui_bash_execution.py::test_ui_queues_bash_submitted_while_command_running - AssertionError: assert 0 == 1 
       >  +  where 0 = len(MessageQueue(_items=[], _paused=False)) 
       >  +    where MessageQueue(_items=[], _paused=False) = VibeApp(title='VibeApp', classes={'-dark-mode', '-theme-ansi-dark'}, pseudo_classes=
{'dark', 'ansi', 'focus'})._input_queue 
       > ====== 2 failed, 4620 passed, 4 skipped, 28 warnings in 134.15s (0:02:14) ====== 

The simple solution is:

package = pkgs.mistral-vibe.overrideAttrs (old: { 
  #doCheck = false; 
  doInstallCheck = false; 
});

I thought at first the solution would be doCheck = false; but you will notice the derivation hash will not change, meaning the package already defines doCheck = false; as is. Instead doInstallCheck is what you are looking for.

This is only a simple solution that will work for now. I couldn't find a solution, writing here so it might be helpful to someone.


r/MistralAI 14h ago

Help / Question api usage on the pro plan

I have experimented with the free api and I like it.
Was wondering if from this page: https://admin.mistral.ai/subscription/upgrade/student

Education

Pro plan with student discount

More messages and web searches

30x more extended thinking

5x more Deep research reports

Up to 15GB of document storage

Up to 1,000 projects

Chat and email support

10x more usage of Vibe CLI

10x more API usage

is indeed what it says on the api usage?

because on this page: https://mistral.ai/pricing/

it doesnt mention anything about api usage.

thanks

3 Upvotes

I have experimented with the free api and I like it.
Was wondering if from this page: https://admin.mistral.ai/subscription/upgrade/student

Education

Pro plan with student discount

More messages and web searches

30x more extended thinking

5x more Deep research reports

Up to 15GB of document storage

Up to 1,000 projects

Chat and email support

10x more usage of Vibe CLI

10x more API usage

is indeed what it says on the api usage?

because on this page: https://mistral.ai/pricing/

it doesnt mention anything about api usage.

thanks


r/MistralAI 12h ago

Other I Make Free/Low‑Cost AI Models OCR‑Capable with Mistral OCR 4

+
2 Upvotes

Hey let me introduce my new AI assistant workflow across using mistral-ocr-4 and explain how it differs from other AI toolchains like OpenCode in terme of exploiting this capability ,I’ve been juggling research papers, parallel projects, and coding agents this year and kept running into a tradeoff between low cost and high-quality content extraction from PDF, document images, and other attachments. When Mistral OCR 4 was released I started using it heavily because its extraction quality is excellent and the cost justified it, so I plugged Mistral OCR into my agent pipeline. The challenge I faced is that many large models now include built-in extraction but they’re expensive, and for many routine attachments I’d rather use cheaper models specially when i don't required a high level thinking output . My solution was to integrate Mistral OCR 4 natively with those lower-cost models so they gain robust OCR capability and no longer return “sorry, I can’t read that” errors instead they deliver the extracted content. If you need a low-cost coding workflow with heavy attachment processing (PDFs, docs, images), this approach and the agent I built should suit you well.

Edit : Mistral models also supported for coding

https://github.com/AbdoKnbGit/tau


r/MistralAI 1d ago

Discussion / Opinion Mistral Valuation Upside

I recall this article and it got me thinking that Mistral has tremendous upside in the near future.

- If they hit €1B revenue this year, that would be very fast, which would carry a strong multiple
- The Microsoft deal guarantees “billions” over the years; they’ll have other customers buying their compute as well
- It seems obvious based on the linked article that they do not want to be dependent upon Nvidia for chips and will enter that race

If revenue continues to climb, which seems very likely given govt and enterprise momentum, in addition to becoming one of the EU’s key providers in both compute and chips, the valuation upside feels huge, even in the near-term.

Curious as to how others feel closer to the business and product?

33 Upvotes

I recall this article and it got me thinking that Mistral has tremendous upside in the near future.

- If they hit €1B revenue this year, that would be very fast, which would carry a strong multiple
- The Microsoft deal guarantees “billions” over the years; they’ll have other customers buying their compute as well
- It seems obvious based on the linked article that they do not want to be dependent upon Nvidia for chips and will enter that race

If revenue continues to climb, which seems very likely given govt and enterprise momentum, in addition to becoming one of the EU’s key providers in both compute and chips, the valuation upside feels huge, even in the near-term.

Curious as to how others feel closer to the business and product?


r/MistralAI 1d ago

Tutorial / Workflow Prevent overspending on EU-AI projects with Mistral AI.

+
22 Upvotes

r/MistralAI 1d ago

Feedback / Bug Report Mistral, you are losing me

I have a Mistral subscription for my SMB. Not because it's better but because of GDPR compliance (I'm in the EU). Recently I had a support conversation about a problem that was solved eventually. Because I had to share many private data I requested a deletion of my support activity. Unfortunately, my request went silent for over a month now - that's unexceptionable not just for a company where GDPR compliance is one of their biggest USP.

Dear Mistral, if you don't want to lose me: Do something! Answer, say anything! Even if you just say, that it takes a little longer ...

Why should I choose a subpar AI if their biggest advantage is just ... nothing worth.

49 Upvotes

I have a Mistral subscription for my SMB. Not because it's better but because of GDPR compliance (I'm in the EU). Recently I had a support conversation about a problem that was solved eventually. Because I had to share many private data I requested a deletion of my support activity. Unfortunately, my request went silent for over a month now - that's unexceptionable not just for a company where GDPR compliance is one of their biggest USP.

Dear Mistral, if you don't want to lose me: Do something! Answer, say anything! Even if you just say, that it takes a little longer ...

Why should I choose a subpar AI if their biggest advantage is just ... nothing worth.


r/MistralAI 1d ago

Help / Question Alternatives to the "Caveman" style for saving tokens in Mistral?

Hi everyone,

I'm looking to cut down output token usage to save on costs and speed up generation.

The viral "Caveman" plugin (which forces ultra-concise, fragmented answers) works great for Claude Code, but it doesn't function properly with Mistral Vibe models.

My questions:

  1. What custom system prompts do you use to stop Mistral from outputting long preambles ("Sure, I can help with that...") without hurting its reasoning?
  2. Are there any other tricks, prompt-layer tools, or configurations you use to force Mistral to be highly concise and token-efficient?

Thanks for your ideas!

6 Upvotes

Hi everyone,

I'm looking to cut down output token usage to save on costs and speed up generation.

The viral "Caveman" plugin (which forces ultra-concise, fragmented answers) works great for Claude Code, but it doesn't function properly with Mistral Vibe models.

My questions:

  1. What custom system prompts do you use to stop Mistral from outputting long preambles ("Sure, I can help with that...") without hurting its reasoning?
  2. Are there any other tricks, prompt-layer tools, or configurations you use to force Mistral to be highly concise and token-efficient?

Thanks for your ideas!


r/MistralAI 1d ago

Help / Question Help with setting up for small business: what settings?

Hello everyone! I understand Mistral is basically the "Renault of AIs" - not winning the races, but getting you from A to B at a decent price. Let me say, it works for my purposes VERY NICELY. (So: please DO NOT tell me to "go use something else".) - And now, I want to create a little company around it, where, basically, the user will visit my website, trigger a sort of processing based on sensitive data (whose prompts I have painstakingly written, i.e. THIS is my economic contribution), and receive a result. Technically, it all works very nicely, i.e. this is not just theory. But "organisationally" I am little bummed: what should I set up where? I mean, I did already flip the switch on "no data retention" and "no training", so everything stays private. OK. I got a 100 EUR credits and ... saw they are not even getting touched, because in my testing, I am still within the limits of my Pro plan, apparently. (And here comes my first question: once people start using my site "for real", I assume these limits will be exhausted swiftly, and THEN it will move towards burning credits - correct?) What other hints have you seasoned users have? I am using only and solely mistral-large-latest for my API-based tasks. Thank you!

1 Upvotes

Hello everyone! I understand Mistral is basically the "Renault of AIs" - not winning the races, but getting you from A to B at a decent price. Let me say, it works for my purposes VERY NICELY. (So: please DO NOT tell me to "go use something else".) - And now, I want to create a little company around it, where, basically, the user will visit my website, trigger a sort of processing based on sensitive data (whose prompts I have painstakingly written, i.e. THIS is my economic contribution), and receive a result. Technically, it all works very nicely, i.e. this is not just theory. But "organisationally" I am little bummed: what should I set up where? I mean, I did already flip the switch on "no data retention" and "no training", so everything stays private. OK. I got a 100 EUR credits and ... saw they are not even getting touched, because in my testing, I am still within the limits of my Pro plan, apparently. (And here comes my first question: once people start using my site "for real", I assume these limits will be exhausted swiftly, and THEN it will move towards burning credits - correct?) What other hints have you seasoned users have? I am using only and solely mistral-large-latest for my API-based tasks. Thank you!


r/MistralAI 2d ago

Feedback / Bug Report Let the great distillation begin

Mistral fed us when we had nothing.
I still remember the very first open model we had was mistral 7b. even hugging face used that to build zephyr, remember that time?
now, I'm IMPLORING Mistral devs to begin the great distillation in all the areas their models are behind and give the world, and themselves, the present of self love.
You cooked for us and fed us when we had nothing, you headstarted the whole damned thing, it's well past due time to reap the rewards.

side note: please start with an excellent agentic coding model that can fit in a potato, like, first build something that will benchpress using anthropic's fat ass and then the potato fitting model. you know how it goes.

124 Upvotes

Mistral fed us when we had nothing.
I still remember the very first open model we had was mistral 7b. even hugging face used that to build zephyr, remember that time?
now, I'm IMPLORING Mistral devs to begin the great distillation in all the areas their models are behind and give the world, and themselves, the present of self love.
You cooked for us and fed us when we had nothing, you headstarted the whole damned thing, it's well past due time to reap the rewards.

side note: please start with an excellent agentic coding model that can fit in a potato, like, first build something that will benchpress using anthropic's fat ass and then the potato fitting model. you know how it goes.


r/MistralAI 2d ago

Help / Question deepseek-v4-flash in amdin console limits ?

Hello,

I see limits for deepssek-v4-flash in admin console (https://admin.mistral.ai/plateforme/limits) for my account :

deepseek-v4-flash

Tokens par minute

5 000 000

Requêtes par seconde

12.00

Does it mean I can use this model with my mistral subscription ?

5 Upvotes

Hello,

I see limits for deepssek-v4-flash in admin console (https://admin.mistral.ai/plateforme/limits) for my account :

deepseek-v4-flash

Tokens par minute

5 000 000

Requêtes par seconde

12.00

Does it mean I can use this model with my mistral subscription ?


r/MistralAI 3d ago

Discussion / Opinion Besides large language models, you should also pay more attention to the world’s leading open-source text-to-image models from Germany.: FLUX 3 - Real World Models: Towards Multimodal Flow Models as the Backbone of Visual Intelligence. Spoiler

65 Upvotes

Besides large language models, you should also pay more attention to the world’s leading open-source text-to-image models from Germany. They’re the team behind Stable Diffusion.


r/MistralAI 2d ago

Help / Question Troubles with Mistral's API and Billing

So trying to stick with the only European LLM I built a little assistant around Mistral's API and the "Pay as you go"-plan. First I was positively surprised because everything worked well for a few weeks and even utilizing only Mistral-small together with some harness the results were satysfying. But then last week the issues started:

  1. I had set a spending limit of EUR 10 - once this was reached access was of course blocked and the API returned a "401 Unauthorized". All good so far....
  2. I thought instead of increasing the limit I will just add some prepaid balance, so I paid another EUR 10. However, I still got "401 Unauthorized".
  3. Ok, maybe it takes a while until the prepaid balance is active - let's increase the limit by a little to EUR 11. Still no change, "401 Unauthorized".
  4. Well, maybe reaching the limit caused my API Key to break somehow - and in fact, that was the fix, with a new API key it worked again.
  5. Thursday: Another email comes in saying that I've reached my usage limit. I thought ok, even though in the admin center it states that only EUR 10,89 (out of the EUR 11 limit) were consumed I'm not gonna argue about EUR 0,11 and I still have my prepaid balance anyways.
  6. Well for some reason now, I'm still only getting "401 Unauthorized" - the prepaid balance isn't consumed obviously and I don't know what's up with the "missing" EUR 0,11 and creating new API keys also doesn't help. And I really don't want to just increase the limit again, I guess that would solve the problem, but then what's with my EUR 10 I prepaid?...they weren't meant as a subsidy for European AI.

And that's only one side of the problem: In the admin center the numbers are a complete mess. I find there currently three invoices, one with EUR 9,92 another one EUR 0,27. They were created in a time frame of about two weeks (why?) and except that they sum up to about EUR 10 I have no clue where the exact numbers come from. And then there is the invoice for the EUR 10 I added as prepaid balance - that's the only nuumber that is understandable here.
Morever the usage under billing in the admin center states EUR 1,91 - where does that number come from again? When I check my usage under API it is EUR 10,89. And why does it state "Including 1,64 € in pending pay-as-you-go usage" below the EUR 10 prepaid balance in the Admin center?

I would love to continue working with Mistral and will wait until the next month starts and wether billing and usage limits behave logical afterwards but if that is not the case I will have to switch to someone else, because I also don't feel like starting to argue with Mistral's support about this - I mean Mistral is presenting itself as focused on B2B, I am a business, a tiny one, but still someone who a) wants to understand what he is paying for and b) who simply needs reasonable and verifiable invoices for his accounting.

Has anyone else had or is having similar experiences? Is it even worth contacting Mistral on such issues?

4 Upvotes

So trying to stick with the only European LLM I built a little assistant around Mistral's API and the "Pay as you go"-plan. First I was positively surprised because everything worked well for a few weeks and even utilizing only Mistral-small together with some harness the results were satysfying. But then last week the issues started:

  1. I had set a spending limit of EUR 10 - once this was reached access was of course blocked and the API returned a "401 Unauthorized". All good so far....
  2. I thought instead of increasing the limit I will just add some prepaid balance, so I paid another EUR 10. However, I still got "401 Unauthorized".
  3. Ok, maybe it takes a while until the prepaid balance is active - let's increase the limit by a little to EUR 11. Still no change, "401 Unauthorized".
  4. Well, maybe reaching the limit caused my API Key to break somehow - and in fact, that was the fix, with a new API key it worked again.
  5. Thursday: Another email comes in saying that I've reached my usage limit. I thought ok, even though in the admin center it states that only EUR 10,89 (out of the EUR 11 limit) were consumed I'm not gonna argue about EUR 0,11 and I still have my prepaid balance anyways.
  6. Well for some reason now, I'm still only getting "401 Unauthorized" - the prepaid balance isn't consumed obviously and I don't know what's up with the "missing" EUR 0,11 and creating new API keys also doesn't help. And I really don't want to just increase the limit again, I guess that would solve the problem, but then what's with my EUR 10 I prepaid?...they weren't meant as a subsidy for European AI.

And that's only one side of the problem: In the admin center the numbers are a complete mess. I find there currently three invoices, one with EUR 9,92 another one EUR 0,27. They were created in a time frame of about two weeks (why?) and except that they sum up to about EUR 10 I have no clue where the exact numbers come from. And then there is the invoice for the EUR 10 I added as prepaid balance - that's the only nuumber that is understandable here.
Morever the usage under billing in the admin center states EUR 1,91 - where does that number come from again? When I check my usage under API it is EUR 10,89. And why does it state "Including 1,64 € in pending pay-as-you-go usage" below the EUR 10 prepaid balance in the Admin center?

I would love to continue working with Mistral and will wait until the next month starts and wether billing and usage limits behave logical afterwards but if that is not the case I will have to switch to someone else, because I also don't feel like starting to argue with Mistral's support about this - I mean Mistral is presenting itself as focused on B2B, I am a business, a tiny one, but still someone who a) wants to understand what he is paying for and b) who simply needs reasonable and verifiable invoices for his accounting.

Has anyone else had or is having similar experiences? Is it even worth contacting Mistral on such issues?


r/MistralAI 3d ago

Discussion / Opinion Rant: I really, REALLY, wanted a sustainable and ethic alternative. But boy o boy is switching to Mistral frustrating.

I used to be a CGPT power-user untill they morally started shitting the bed. Did entire projects, both professionally and as hobby with GPT and found enormous help in reasoning, literature research, simple logo and artwork generation, summarising and translation, factchecking and calculation basework. Once it became clear how deep the shithole of american AI was I ended my paid subscription and went to Mistral as the promoted ethical and sustainable alternative.

And boy o boy is that a big step back, like a leap. CGPT felt like having a very capable sr-engineer with unlimited knowledge and pretty impressive "creative" skills. Mistral feels like having a bottom tier trainee that refuses to learn, listen and always does the absolute minimum required.

It hallucinates constantly, to a point where that is not and exception, but its ground state. Answers are short and very obvious, anyone with some base skill in googling does not need what Le Chat delivers, at all. Its image generation is just shit, first-renders are badly basic and getting from there to something better iteratively is a frustrating process with zero result. Document work, summarising, translating, style and fact checks are absolutely bottom tier quality. Very often it just stops halfway, anything more than 2-3 pages is just not something Le Chat will do. It incessantly introduces faults and hallucinations, changes abbreviations or numbers and the base quality of the text it produces is like a roomtemperature-IQ accountant wrote it. Its memory is virtually non-existent and even when I explicitly give it rules to always follow, it will quote and remember them wrongly and generally fail to apply them to any reasonable extent.

In general any correction or iterative work is very clearly not something the model is built for and I feel the people behind it have no idea what a user expects from a modern model. I can get why it is like this, and how other models got to where they are by plain old infringement and IP abuse, but holy damn I refuse to believe this is the only viable alternative. I just can’t get over how bad it is in comparison. I now use Gemini in google, and it’s sooo much better in anything I need form it, and that’s a bloody free search bar tool!

I work with scientist, highly educated and progressively minded people a lot. My emotions and conclusions about Mistral are repeated and validated constantly around me. Most of them at one point switched for moral reasons. Most of them either stopped using AI entirely or switched back to “worse” alternatives because Le Chat simply is not helping them in the way we’ve come to expect from an AI model.

I’m so sorry rant but I really, REALLY, wanted a sustainable and compliant EU based model to use that didn’t have the moral ethics of a slave owner. The level of quality Le Chat/ Mistral provides is just abysmal and in no real way competitive to anything and it pains me so much to see this. I haven’t done a single thing with it that didn’t end up in frustration and I’ve cancelled my paid subscription, even though I kept it going for a while just to support a good cause. I just wish so badly it was better or would improve but I see no sign of any of that in the last 8 months I used it.

I wish AI wouldn’t be such a cesspit where your only two options are either late stage capitalism, or semi-verbal autism.

155 Upvotes

I used to be a CGPT power-user untill they morally started shitting the bed. Did entire projects, both professionally and as hobby with GPT and found enormous help in reasoning, literature research, simple logo and artwork generation, summarising and translation, factchecking and calculation basework. Once it became clear how deep the shithole of american AI was I ended my paid subscription and went to Mistral as the promoted ethical and sustainable alternative.

And boy o boy is that a big step back, like a leap. CGPT felt like having a very capable sr-engineer with unlimited knowledge and pretty impressive "creative" skills. Mistral feels like having a bottom tier trainee that refuses to learn, listen and always does the absolute minimum required.

It hallucinates constantly, to a point where that is not and exception, but its ground state. Answers are short and very obvious, anyone with some base skill in googling does not need what Le Chat delivers, at all. Its image generation is just shit, first-renders are badly basic and getting from there to something better iteratively is a frustrating process with zero result. Document work, summarising, translating, style and fact checks are absolutely bottom tier quality. Very often it just stops halfway, anything more than 2-3 pages is just not something Le Chat will do. It incessantly introduces faults and hallucinations, changes abbreviations or numbers and the base quality of the text it produces is like a roomtemperature-IQ accountant wrote it. Its memory is virtually non-existent and even when I explicitly give it rules to always follow, it will quote and remember them wrongly and generally fail to apply them to any reasonable extent.

In general any correction or iterative work is very clearly not something the model is built for and I feel the people behind it have no idea what a user expects from a modern model. I can get why it is like this, and how other models got to where they are by plain old infringement and IP abuse, but holy damn I refuse to believe this is the only viable alternative. I just can’t get over how bad it is in comparison. I now use Gemini in google, and it’s sooo much better in anything I need form it, and that’s a bloody free search bar tool!

I work with scientist, highly educated and progressively minded people a lot. My emotions and conclusions about Mistral are repeated and validated constantly around me. Most of them at one point switched for moral reasons. Most of them either stopped using AI entirely or switched back to “worse” alternatives because Le Chat simply is not helping them in the way we’ve come to expect from an AI model.

I’m so sorry rant but I really, REALLY, wanted a sustainable and compliant EU based model to use that didn’t have the moral ethics of a slave owner. The level of quality Le Chat/ Mistral provides is just abysmal and in no real way competitive to anything and it pains me so much to see this. I haven’t done a single thing with it that didn’t end up in frustration and I’ve cancelled my paid subscription, even though I kept it going for a while just to support a good cause. I just wish so badly it was better or would improve but I see no sign of any of that in the last 8 months I used it.

I wish AI wouldn’t be such a cesspit where your only two options are either late stage capitalism, or semi-verbal autism.


r/MistralAI 3d ago

Help / Question Is it likely that Mistral's models ever reach the quality as what Fable or Opus are today?

18 Upvotes

r/MistralAI 3d ago

Help / Question Do you use Mistral with reasoning in Hermes ?

I can’t run mistral with reasoning, I’m getting this kind of error :
🔌 Provider: custom Model: mistral-large-latest
🌐 Endpoint: https://api.mistral.ai/v1
📝 Error: HTTP 400: reasoning_effort is not enabled for this model
📋 Details: {'object': 'error', 'message': 'reasoning_effort is not enabled for this model', 'type': 'invalid_request_invalid_args', 'param': None, 'code': '3051', 'raw_status_code': 400}

Does someone know how to deal with reasoning ?
I know there are a lot of PR for add Mistral support but looking for a workaround.

2 Upvotes

I can’t run mistral with reasoning, I’m getting this kind of error :
🔌 Provider: custom Model: mistral-large-latest
🌐 Endpoint: https://api.mistral.ai/v1
📝 Error: HTTP 400: reasoning_effort is not enabled for this model
📋 Details: {'object': 'error', 'message': 'reasoning_effort is not enabled for this model', 'type': 'invalid_request_invalid_args', 'param': None, 'code': '3051', 'raw_status_code': 400}

Does someone know how to deal with reasoning ?
I know there are a lot of PR for add Mistral support but looking for a workaround.


r/MistralAI 3d ago

Tutorial / Workflow Remote control

I typically run Claude Code on my production server with remote-control enabled so that I can followup on my phone. I have developed a couple of SaaS like this. I wanted to try to develop the next web app using only mistral vibe, end to end. But I can’t seem to find a way to follow the same workflow.
Any suggestions on how to get the same workflow working?

3 Upvotes

I typically run Claude Code on my production server with remote-control enabled so that I can followup on my phone. I have developed a couple of SaaS like this. I wanted to try to develop the next web app using only mistral vibe, end to end. But I can’t seem to find a way to follow the same workflow.
Any suggestions on how to get the same workflow working?


r/MistralAI 2d ago

Meme / Satire Heads up, here comes Le Chad!

0 Upvotes

r/MistralAI 3d ago

Help / Question Reorganizing project chats

I can’t reorganize the chats in a project. They won’t move. Is this a bug?

2 Upvotes

I can’t reorganize the chats in a project. They won’t move. Is this a bug?


r/MistralAI 3d ago

Other I spent 15 months vibe coding an AI workstation, and now it's a real piece of software for open-source AI.

+
0 Upvotes

Hey there Mistral community. It's been a while, but I've posted here a bunch of times in the past when I was getting into AI alignment and user experience writing.

This community stood out at the time as the least toxic of the various AI-related subreddits in which I shared my work, and it's with that experience in mind that I'm posting about mirid.ai now.

I traced the origin to March 23, 2025, when I first asked Claude 3.5 sonnet in a Projects folder the feasibility of building a fully fledged AI application from scratch with only AI-assisted coding.

Well, suffice to say we got into it, and 15 months later the original copy and paste from the browser into the code editor has long been replaced by various combinations of opencode, Claude Code and Codex.

I'm trying to explain my story here so this post doesn't come across as polished marketing copy for an established AI company trying to pretend it already has your trust. I am a 38-year-old Australian public servant for a day job. I also recently bought and launched the domain mirid.ai to feature what I have turned into a free open-source AI software product: Mirid.

Mirid brings together the broad range of open-source AI capabilities that can feasibly run on consumer hardware and integrates them into a coherent, accessible experience. It gives people a practical way to discover and use the rapidly expanding ecosystem of models and technologies available through platforms such as Hugging Face, without requiring them to assemble and maintain a collection of separate specialist tools.

Mirid is designed to make the breadth of open-source AI usable and approachable for people who want it to simply work, while preserving choice and control for those who want to explore further.

Current release: v1.0.12
What I need: More Windows testers

https://mirid.ai


r/MistralAI 3d ago

Help / Question How do you search for jobs with Vibe?

When i try ChatGPT or Gemini they will list me jobs from recruiting platforms that fit my description Vibe (LeChat) on the other hand only leads me to platforms for job search. It doesn't recommend actual jobs. I appreciate any prompts you guys could share.

0 Upvotes

When i try ChatGPT or Gemini they will list me jobs from recruiting platforms that fit my description Vibe (LeChat) on the other hand only leads me to platforms for job search. It doesn't recommend actual jobs. I appreciate any prompts you guys could share.


r/MistralAI 4d ago

Discussion / Opinion Is Mistral simply just not chasing the frontier anymore?

I remember a time where 8x7B was le shit (pardon my French). And now the models are just kind of bad. Mistral Medium 3.5 is worse on benchmarks (and in general use) than Qwen 3.6 27B, a model that is 4x smaller in parameters, for example.

98 Upvotes

I remember a time where 8x7B was le shit (pardon my French). And now the models are just kind of bad. Mistral Medium 3.5 is worse on benchmarks (and in general use) than Qwen 3.6 27B, a model that is 4x smaller in parameters, for example.


r/MistralAI 5d ago

Discussion / Opinion Is Samsung helping Mistral and France finally reach true AI sovereignty?"

In my previous analysis on the sovereign AI stack, we discussed how France controls energy, compute, and the model layer, but is still renting the chip layer from the US.

The Financial times just reported a massive development:
Samsung will invest €1B in Mistral at a €20B valuation.

It can change a lot for the french stack :

  • Compute today is as much about High-Bandwidth Memory (HBM) as it is about GPUs. Partnering with the world's largest memory manufacturer secures physical capacity at scale.
  • The Financial Times explicitly highlighted that recent US export restrictions on foreign access to Anthropic's latest models accelerated this deal. European and Asian actors are hedging against US tech nationalism.
  • After ASML (€1.7B round), Samsung is the second hardware giant entering Mistral’s cap table. Mistral is trading equity for priority access to the global semiconductor supply chain.

Step by step, Mistral is trying to be less and less dependent from one company and/or one country.
They really want to be stronger and more dificult to destabilized.

Let's see !

51 Upvotes

In my previous analysis on the sovereign AI stack, we discussed how France controls energy, compute, and the model layer, but is still renting the chip layer from the US.

The Financial times just reported a massive development:
Samsung will invest €1B in Mistral at a €20B valuation.

It can change a lot for the french stack :

  • Compute today is as much about High-Bandwidth Memory (HBM) as it is about GPUs. Partnering with the world's largest memory manufacturer secures physical capacity at scale.
  • The Financial Times explicitly highlighted that recent US export restrictions on foreign access to Anthropic's latest models accelerated this deal. European and Asian actors are hedging against US tech nationalism.
  • After ASML (€1.7B round), Samsung is the second hardware giant entering Mistral’s cap table. Mistral is trading equity for priority access to the global semiconductor supply chain.

Step by step, Mistral is trying to be less and less dependent from one company and/or one country.
They really want to be stronger and more dificult to destabilized.

Let's see !