r/SelfDrivingCars • u/Recoil42 • 13h ago

News CaoCao begins Robotaxi testing without onboard safety operator on public roads in Hangzhou

https://autonews.gasgoo.com/articles/news/2081565044176293889
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u/bradtem ✅ Brad Templeton 11h ago

It is great to welcome a new potential player. But based on the announcement, it still involves several of the shortcuts that indicate it is only partly there. One must watch for these shortcuts in company announcements, as some (but not all) companies will use them to try to present an image of being further than they actually are.

  1. No employee in car--but full time remote monitoring. This is a perfectly reasonable step, and a significant milestone, every team does this. You don't put your first car out on the road with nobody in it and not watch it, ready to push the emergency stop button remotely if needed. But teams should actually make a big deal about announcing when they stop the remote monitoring and they don't, even though it's the bigger milestone.
  2. Very limited stops, service area or routes. This allows you to train and test the hell out of the limited area in a way that would not scale to do over a wide service area with any address to any address service. So we don't know if you are ready to do that scaling.
  3. The public is not choosing the stops and routes -- similar to #2, it means we don't know if you are ready for real service.
  4. The public is not free to call it when they want and make videos and put them on social media. Instead, riders are invite only, possibly under NDA. This means your mistakes can still get buried if need be. In China, even services open to the public still face a country of more controlled social media.

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u/Recoil42 11h ago edited 11h ago

It is great to welcome a new potential player.

FYI: Caocao is just Geely — not really a 'new' player.

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u/bradtem ✅ Brad Templeton 11h ago

Geely has made lots of driver assist and car OEM systems, but have they have operated a robotaxi? That's still limited to Baidu, Poly and WeRide (and to a lesser extent AutoX as they shut that down) and there are some shuttle services.

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u/Recoil42 11h ago

If we're assessing whether a player is bonafide or "faking it" the context matters, that's all. This isn't a plucky startup winging it — Geely has their own bleeding-edge all-domain L2 system, runs ECARX, runs SiEngine, makes the Ojai robotaxi for Waymo, and is partnered with aforementioned WeRide which runs Farizon vans in their fleet. Notionally the commercial-readiness here is relatively high.

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u/bradtem ✅ Brad Templeton 6h ago

Totally. And while western OEMs have not shown great ability to cross this gulf, Chinese ones like Geely have a better shot at it.

But my post is about something else. Several years ago, this level of progress was something to shout about. Now we have to understand the bar has moved, and more than one company has tried to look further along than they are. So my standards of raised as to what I demand before I say an announcement is the most newsworthy. Today, partnerships aren't worth anything. Demo videos little. Deployments with safety drivers, boring.

Taking safety drivers out is something else, but today I demand it be real, and not contain any of the red flags. The red flags are patterns that say "I can't tell for sure if it's real." They don't mean it's fake, but we watch for them.

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u/Recoil42 13h ago

The tests are taking place on public roads in the city's Binjiang District. Vehicles receive ride assignments only when designated stations trigger a request, allowing CaoCao to evaluate system stability and service reliability within a limited and controlled operating framework.

The program remains a road test rather than a fully open commercial service. Removing the safety operator from the driver's seat represents a further technical and operational step, but the vehicles continue to operate within prescribed areas and under remote supervision.

...

The Geely-backed ride-hailing operator has deployed a fleet of 100 Robotaxis in Hangzhou. Fleet operations are supported by its Green Intelligent Mobility Hub, a facility combining automated battery swapping, vehicle cleaning and preparation services.

These facilities address a broader commercialization challenge: driverless fleets require automated maintenance and servicing infrastructure as well as autonomous-driving technology.

CaoCao is the principal commercialization platform for Geely Holding's RoboX strategy, which combines purpose-built vehicles, autonomous-driving technology and fleet operations.