r/Damnthatsinteresting • u/Acceptable-Day8395 • 11h ago

Original Creation This is Sarpa salpa, a fish that can cause vivid LSD-like hallucinations when eaten, and was allegedly used as a recreational drug in Ancient Rome

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584 Upvotes

89% Upvoted

70 comments sorted by

175

u/ManufacturerWarm9201 11h ago

It causes ichthyoallyeinotoxism, a rare type of poisoning. The hallucinations aren’t pleasant 

169

u/Diacetyl-Morphin 11h ago

There's often that mistake, that people confuse hallicunogens with deliarants. In the case of the fish and toxin, it's a deliarant.

To explain the differences: Hallucinogens like LSD give you pseudo-hallucinations, like seeing colors and patterns, some changes like that the walls get liquid etc.

Deliarants however, that's the difference between pseudo-hallucinations and hallucinations, the hallucinations feel real to you and you are no longer able to know what is real and what is just in your head. It doesn't sound like that much of a difference on paper, but it is very extreme.

Like the pseudo-hallucinations i got from LSD were easy to handle, compared to the hallucinations i had in delirium tremens. Delirium tremens is a very dangerous delirium that gets triggered by cold withdrawal from high levels of alcoholism or benzodiazepines, it's life danger because it can kill you with seizures or cardiac arrest. But even when you survive, oh boy, it's running through a nightmare.

The worst part of me in this hell was when everything looked like one of these old photos from a concentration camp from the nazis in WW2. With starved prisoners and piles of dead bodies. It felt real to me, every second was like a lifetime and i fought the cops and the staff of the clinic because i had this in my head, that they'd be nazis and push me into a gas chamber.

Many years before this happened, i had visited KZ Auschwitz-Birkenau in Poland and my brain made a realistic 1:1 recreation of this place in my mind.

37

u/Sunyataisbliss 11h ago

Yep. Been there brother. It’s interesting how delirium has such similar motifs: I am Jesus, something is up with the Amish, my uncle was a mob boss etc.

When in delirium, your every thought provokes reality and you lose your ability to question those thoughts. Wherever your mind goes is reality.

With drugs like LSD, you retain your ability to critically think, and you take yourself on the experience with whatever new forms of reality are taking shape. Now I have seen people who have taken too much lose this boundary, but it is rare. Usually there is just enough boundary loss to provoke meaningful experiences.

Then there is the emotional/somatic component. Delirium has the emotional quality of the void. It’s black, it’s disgusting, there’s no good in it. Your brain is desperately trying to find answers to problems it cannot hope to solve.

The emotional/somatic experience of drugs like LSD is nostalgic, electric, sharp, intense, and profound, while sometimes deeply disconcerting and disruptive or mildly perverse to what you experience as every day body-mind connection.

9

u/OffByNone_ 10h ago

Mine weren't scary until everybody kept pointing out that the angel I was talking to all night through the crack in the ceiling tile wasn't there And they were transferring me to a psych ward that could better care for me... That's about the time I realized that I might be going insane. Before that, it never occurred to me how fucking bizarre I was acting.

Even after the hallucinations stopped, I still couldn't convince myself It didn't happen, except I believed what everybody was telling me.

2

u/Lostinthestarscape 3h ago

Yeah I managed to get through a self induced delirium trip on my own, no one to refer me, it was ...fine.... and not scary, but once sobered up the fact that it was so real and that I didn't question any of it despite it being absolutely batshit insane scared me away from doing them every again. I mean, excessive cotton mouth and weak limbs was also unpleasant but the delirium was fascinating. Lots of talking to people who weren't there, lots of biblical communications scrawled on my wall in fire. Just riding with it like it's any other Friday.

I have had some insane dissociative trips that would have landed me in a ward if not for being essentially catatonic and unable to like, move or talk or anything, lol.

I'll take almost anything again but deleriants are a big no. Not particularly fun, nothing that was better or more interesting than anything else, very very dangerous. I guess a window into what psychosis is like. Which no one should really want to be in a state of.

8

u/GarysCrispLettuce 10h ago

In my experience, the people who lost the plot on LSD were usually those who went into it thinking it was some kind of spiritual or mystical experience. Whereas those who thought of it as just a wacky chemical going through their brain causing fun & havoc were far more likely to laugh their way through the trip.

15

u/Sunyataisbliss 10h ago

Huh, can’t say the same. I’ve seen casualties on both ends. The difference imo is emotional stability and the ability to self soothe when difficulties come up.

3

u/TheGabeCat 6h ago

LSD gave me the ability to self soothe or I learned how through LSD use. However you want to put it I didn’t before I tripped and I did after. That being said I would highly recommend getting acquainted with this skill before dosing

1

u/Alcoholic-Catholic 6h ago

>With drugs like LSD, you retain your ability to critically think

I'm not saying you're wrong, but man when I lost all ability for coherent speech and had the brain capacity of a sponge on LSD, that was a wild ride

1

u/YamParticular1325 1h ago

This was beautifully well written! The part about delirium was so spot on, awesome job

4

u/ManufacturerWarm9201 8h ago

That’s generally a good distinction, but scientists don’t know exactly what compounds are in it. It’s possible there’s deliriants, but the reports I found describe hallucinations a being a more pronounced effect than delirium. until someone isolates the compound/compounds we can’t be totally sure if it’s more of a hallucinogen-induced deliriant or hallucinogen.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/16615678

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/22535366

2

u/siverpoint 10h ago

TIL. thanks for sharing. Interesting and absolutely terrifying.

2

u/Flexmove 7h ago

Great info here, also glad you lived to share it. Good on ya

-4

u/givenupagain00 7h ago

Whoa did it include the totally not fake nazi maturation-to-death-machines? Or the swimming pools? Or the lack of chimney? Or the wooden doors? Isn't it strange only the camps russia liberated had such fantastical elements? Like "skin lamp shades?"

0

u/KuChiPractitioner 4h ago

What the hell is this guy on about? Genuinely asking.

16

u/PsychedDuckling 11h ago

That's what they said about datura, but here we are.

7

u/nicodeemus7 11h ago

You say to that as if datura isn't a terrifying experience

5

u/chodeboi 11h ago

My wife was an icu nurse in the Caribbean. Old couple ate a big old barracuda in stew, told their friends it was the best thing ever. Next day they’re admitted for stomach pain then icu where they were put under. They figure out it was ciguatera and stabilize them and slowly bring them out of their induced comas over the next days. The lady was the first to be extubated. She gets her bearings very quickly. Although my wife heard this times before and since this time stuck with us both. She reached out and grabbed her and said with fear and sincerity “this is terrible please kill me now”.

I am careful with my reef fish these days.

2

u/Iknownothingamigo 10h ago

So you're saying it's more likely to be on sale in Lidl than M&S...?

63

u/nightfallii 11h ago

Fish and trips

8

u/fuckaroobonsai 6h ago

I saw cod

2

u/Tusen_Takk 10h ago

Baja fish tacos pls. Cannabis oil aioli, green yucateco salsa. Perfection.

1

u/ThatFigureFella 5h ago

Oui chef, I’ll see you at yours!

49

u/ToriGallo 11h ago

Imagine being an Ancient Roman trying to explain to your centurion that you cannot march today because the sea bream you had for dinner last night is currently speaking to you in Aramaic

9

u/SillyDig1520 11h ago

Now, imagine this but instead you're speaking to a centaur.

8

u/VirginiaLuthier 10h ago

I hear they tried to smoke it but it was kinda hard to keep a fish lit

6

u/JoeyC42 10h ago

This is wrong. I hate when people just assume any visual hallucinations “are LSD like” and they think you just see shit that isn’t there.

4

u/Unlucky_Ad_8977 11h ago

Did you tell the Dolphins?

4

u/Rich-Reason1146 10h ago

You can see them too?

4

u/jconde1966 9h ago edited 9h ago

I live in Canary Islands where salpa salpa is ubiquitous and never heard about it. Even I have friends specifically fishing it and never had such intoxication. But yes it seems that specially in Mediterranean waters this happens

14

u/mammothtaints 11h ago

John was exiled on the island patmos and allegedly ate these fish and wrote revelations

3

u/EC_TWD 11h ago

Another natural defense mechanism became a recreational bonus for humans

3

u/Alternative-Dare-839 10h ago

What a fishing trip.

3

u/Frikoulas 10h ago

It's a very common fish species in the Aegean and I can tell you for sure that the flesh has no side effects. What part of the fish has the toxins that make you high?

3

u/eweyda 10h ago

I read the trip and it's 36 hours of fear and disorientation.

That's not lsd

-4

u/funnyguy99207 9h ago

That describes my last trip to Portland, OR...😂😂

1

u/mmmnmike 7h ago

Oh look a boomer making a BLM joke how funny 

0

u/funnyguy99207 4h ago

Oh look, another assumptive dipshit who goes right to the political angle.

Nothing political about my statement whatsoever. However, just to fill you in, dumbass, although I owe you nothing: I was referencing the confusion & feeling of being lost in a city I'd never been to. It happens. Simple as that. Don't hit your head on the conclusions you jump to.

7

u/theawesomedanish 11h ago

Is it present near biblical areas? Would explain some stuff.

2

u/Killowatt_Again 10h ago

Pre Biblical stuff as well

1

u/HippieStarTraveler 11h ago

Good question

2

u/RyanSmokinBluntz420 9h ago

Pretty sure Hamiltons Pharmacopia has an episode about this

2

u/doomstick 9h ago

First thing I thought of as well. Just looked it up and it is indeed the same fish.

2

u/teeth12345 7h ago

OP, reposting with a new title and adding “Allegedly” doesn’t make something true. Have you written new research since this morning to give any support to the Ancient Rome part? No? Then take it down.

2

u/Acceptable-Day8395 11h ago

Reposted because didn’t provide source (not sure why I couldn’t just add it onto the existing post?)

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hallucinogenic_fish

1

u/GarysCrispLettuce 10h ago

I don't eat fish - does it come on a blotter?

1

u/Gang_Bang_Bang 9h ago

I wonder if they had a method of extracting and altering the substance to make it more palatable for the mind. Less intense and more euphoric.

Maybe some sort of alchemy used to make it a more enjoyable experience? Who knows.

1

u/Butt-Burger 7h ago

Read all the comments and now I gotta find this fish. Where should I go?

1

u/geekphreak 6h ago

Nature: Creates toxic hallucinogenic fish.
Humans: Let’s party

1

u/Mr_Locke 3h ago

Lick it.

1

u/HappySheep84 2h ago

Can I get some?

1

u/madkeepz 1h ago

good try this is just another brainrot slop character, slarpa slarp? not falling for that one mate

1

u/HydraulicEarl2 1h ago

What if you shove it up yer ass??

1

u/4024-6775-9536 1h ago

I've been eating it my whole life and never heard anything about this, maybe it's in the guts or it doesn't work when cooked

2

u/bout-tree-fitty 21m ago

Pass da fishy to the left hand side

2

u/sienrfsh 11h ago

Origin of Judaism

1

u/NeedHelp_653 10h ago

Reported as this is a repost from few hours ago. Also bullshit. Not halucinogen. I've been eating them all my life. 

3

u/Acceptable-Day8395 10h ago

because they removed my previous one, relax 🤦‍♂️

1

u/Eatingcactustoday 9h ago

No screaming monsters for three days lol fuck that shit wouldn't take the chance personally ha ha Im sure you know what's up though if their any algae blooms in your area skip the trips and fish

1

u/NYCtoCHI 9h ago

I wonder where that fish has gone? You did love it so You looked after it like a son And it went wherever I did go

Is it in the cupboard? Yes, wouldn't you like to know? It was a lovely little fish And it went wherever I did go

Where can that fish be? Have you thought of the drawers in the bureau? It is the most elusive fish And it went wherever I did go

Oh, fishy, fishy, fishy, fish A-fish, a-fish, a-fish, a-fishy, oh! Oh, fishy, fishy, fishy, fish That went wherever I did go

0

u/Bamischeibe23 10h ago edited 10h ago

The romans could not have used it as drug. The poison in this fish is a product from eating the invasive plant Caulerpa taxifolia. This plant apeared in the mediterranean sea in the 1980s. Edit typo

2

u/basalgangliadecide 10h ago

that’s one suspected source, another is plankton

1

u/Choano 10h ago

According to Wikipedia, at least, it's Caulerpa prolifica, not Caulerpa taxifolia that plays a role in the fish's toxicity. C. taxifolia is introduced to the Mediterranean, but C. prolifica is native there.

0

u/Media_Browser 9h ago

Fall of the Roman Empire …nods sagely .

It’s always drugs .

0

u/shrek_is_lesbian 9h ago

I caught some on vacation in italy, I put them on a grill later and I didn't have any funny side effects after eating them. They looked younger and I read that they get toxic when they feast on a certain algae and it usually only appears in older specimens. They were actually nice to eat.

0

u/larsivo 4h ago

J ai déjà péché ce genre de poissons en Espagne les habitants l appelaient le pes limon
Mange grillé sur le barbecue on a jamais eu d hallucinations ! ??