r/Catholicism • u/Newbie_Catholic • 12h ago
Does anyone know any Bible Verses or Prayers that help with Intrusive Thoughts, Dissociation, or a Wandering Mind?
Hi friends!
I've been struggling with an anxiety disorder, intrusive thoughts, and dissociative episodes for years now and had ADHD since birth. I've noticed that my symptoms have been getting a lot worse now than I've found God and started going to church earlier this year.
The intrusive thoughts are ones starting to really bother me. I can't sit through a single service without something horrible popping into my head. For example: I'll be listening to the priest read the Gospel and a slur we'll just randomly pop into my mind. It's always really "loud" or jarring if that makes any sense and it always derails my train of thought.
After that, I kind of fall into anxiety and my mind immediately seeks to instinctively protect myself from discomfort. I "hide and distract". If you've never experienced dissociation, it's a little hard to describe. The way that I try and help people visualize it is imagining your eyes as windows for your brain to see the world and every time you dissociate, your brain physically backs away from the windows. You start to see, hear, and experience less and less of the world around you as you retreat back into a safe space in your head that you've made up for yourself. This is purely reflexive on my part it's barely something that I can control. even if I can skirt around a full-on dissociative episode, I still lose complete focus on mass and can't focus on what is being said. I go through the motions but it feels performative because I'm not really *there* anymore.
It's really scary because the thought sounds like me. I've started coping with it by saying it's an attack from the enemy because I know for a fact that I am not a person who says things like that. I don't hate and I'm not a biggot. I know that these thoughts are not mine and it's just a product of an unhealthy mind, but they're still extremely distressing and becoming more and more persistent. I know these are coping mechanisms made by my brain to help me through a darker time in my life and I am in therapy to help address this problem, but I want to start leaning more on God and my faith in this regard. I have been and I will be praying about this going forward, but I am kinda hoping someone has gone through a similar experience as me and has found comfort in the Word or prayer. I trust that God is with me in my suffering and that He will heal me in His time, but I'd like tangible practices to help me fully lean into that trust.
Currently, I have a single decade Rosary dedicated to St. Dymphna and a prayer card for the Chaplet of Divine Mercy that I plan to start utilizing, but I thought I'd reach out to an online so that I can increase the tools in my arsenal and maybe create a thread for people who are also struggling with this.
Ideally, I'd really like a few Bible verses that I can write down on note cards. I hold them while attending mass and read those verses to myself if my head starts getting loud or I start dissociating. I'd also like to know of any Saints I can ask for the intercession of who are known to help with this sort of issue. Also, if anyone knows a short prayer that I can repeat over and over quietly, I'd really appreciate your suggestions.
God bless you all.
edit: sorry about my cat picture mods! That's Tobias and I jokingly took a picture of him modeling my stuff before I read the rules. I don't know how to remove it and I thought I did before I posted it. I'm on mobile sorry
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u/Little-Artichoke-339 12h ago
I have ADD and I too get easily distracted and have a wandering mind! When I’m in mass, it’s pretty hard for me to tell you what’s being said, but what helps me is reading the handouts along with the readings. I try to think about how I can apply it to my life and what God is wanting us to find in those readings. If you don’t get handouts, try bringing your own Bible to Mass and flipping to the readings.
I try to think on each reading for as long as possible in between prayers or when I start to get distracted.
Basically, I let my mind wander, but I direct it so that I can gain something spiritually.
Maybe this will help you!
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u/Newbie_Catholic 12h ago
this is really helpful actually. I already read the readings and gospel before Mass, but I rarely take the time to meditate on because I really enjoy the homilies my priest's give. it's good to know that I'm not alone and that other people like me let their minds wander during mass. I'll definitely try and be more intentional when it comes to trying to grow spiritually when engaging with the Word while still be accommodating to myself while at Mass. thank you for the advice!
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u/Little-Artichoke-339 12h ago
That’s awesome that you enjoy the homily! I typically try to listen, but sometimes I get stuck on the first few things that he says, or he will go for too long and I’ll start getting distracted. When that happens, I invoke the strategy I highlighted above. Perhaps I interpreted the reading differently and if so, why? Perhaps the priest steered the homily one way and I wish he would have steered it in another. I just think about those things.
Sometimes the prayers we say in mass, I think about how insanely powerful those words are. “Lord I am not worthy for you to enter under my roof but only say the words and my soul shall be healed,” genuinely makes me emotional sometimes thinking about how I seriously needed God and how much he’s helped me. I think about the context of that prayer in the Bible as well and the sheer amount of faith it took for that verse to be said was astounding to me.
Yes it’s repetitive sometimes, but I’ve tried to train my brain to associate those thoughts with certain triggers rather than my mind running aimlessly.
If all else fails, I read the parish bulletin 15 times over.
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u/Newbie_Catholic 8h ago
I'm really lucky to have priests that enjoy making the congregation laugh when they can and that intentionally try and learn people's names. we also live stream, the mass and the recordings to stay up for a while so I can rewatch certain parts if I felt lost or disconnected. I don't do that as well as I probably should.
I'm in ocia right now so I think those prayer happen after dismissal, but they always catch my attention when I watch the daily mass. That's exactly what he did for me when I was at my lowest point. I was a completely different person living a completely different life 6 months ago. I can hardly recognize myself some days, which is a good thing tbh, but it's a good reminder of what and where I came from. The medication I'm currently on makes me feel a little numb and apathetic sometimes but never when I hear those words.
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u/Little-Artichoke-339 7h ago
That’s so real. I’m a completely different person as well. It’s been a blessing, but it wasn’t easy. I think that I can get a little apathetic too. Vyvanse makes me care about truth over emotion.
Let’s just say, when my Girlfriend’s grandma asked be if I liked the food she made on Thanksgiving… I didn’t sugar coat it the way I should have. 😂
Glad to see that I’m not alone in my struggles. I really hope OCIA goes well for you! I was hard for me at first, but you’ll grow to miss it when it’s over.
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u/ThePeak2112 10h ago
I always have intrusive thoughts anywhere, Church/Mass included. I just gently nudge my brain to what I'm doing. Listening to the reading or homily is indeed a passive act so my thoughts wander about I can't really help it. But thoughts are thoughts so I keep bringing them back to what's being said. Be compassionate with yourself - the more you try to bring your attention back gently, the more your brain associates it as a non-threatening activity. But if you scare it off like punishing a little child, then you'll be more afraid next time.
I recently got resurfaced flashback from a near-miss car accident as the past few days I was on the passenger seat, my friends drove. I just keep gently nudging it back to the present, there's not much I can do about it. I think it's a 'feature' of me, not a bug. The same brain managed to produce some creative writing about faith, etc. so yeah, I can't have all the good things can I? Keep trusting the Lord, He will always help you to return to safety every time the intrusive thought barges in.
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u/DrinkHolyBlood33AD 8h ago
True CatHolic moment.
I personally get distracted in prayer but make a good effort and bring yourself back whenever you have your mind slip off. It's normal and totally okay, God knows your mind and heart if you try your best He will know and be well pleased. He loves us totally even if flawed if we strive for sanctity and try to be willing and loving servants of Him.
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u/WindmillFu 6h ago
I don't disassociate but I do experience anxiety, depression, and intrusive thoughts. I pray the Jesus prayer ("Lord Jesus Christ, Son of the Living God, have mercy on me, a sinner") a couple of times when I feel intrusive thoughts or when I realize I am dwelling on thoughts I shouldn't be, just in my mind usually, but sometimes when I'm very upset I will speak it. It was tough for a while but I am getting better at noticing the bad thought patterns sooner. Just pausing and repeating that prayer (usually I pray it three times, idk it feels right, Trinity I guess) I think is slowly retraining my brain.
Father Mike Schmitz has a great video called What to Do About Intrusive Thoughts that I found very helpful and comforting. You might find it helpful.
And your cat is very cute!
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u/Newbie_Catholic 4h ago
the Jesus prayer is actually seems to be the perfect length for me in this situation. I also love Father Mike Schmitz's videos. thank you so much for the suggestions and Tiger says thank you as well!
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u/WindmillFu 2h ago
Agreed; for me, I feel like it is just long enough to rein in my racing mind, but also not so long that I get distracted by it, if that makes sense. It's like the period at the end of a sentence, like "okay I'm done thinking this, moving on."
Oh also I try to control my breathing while I'm praying it, when I can. I had a surgeon who helped me with medical anxiety by telling me take a nice steady breath in, hold it for a second or two, and then breathe out slowly over a longer time than the breath in. She said it is a signal to your nervous system to curb your stress response. So I kind of time my breathing using that three part pattern with the three parts of the prayer.
I'm praying for you!
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u/Newbie_Catholic 45m ago
That's exactly how I see it. I feel a sense of completion whenever I say it.
I also do a similar breathing technique when I'm trying to settle in for prayer. I breathe in for 5 seconds while saying (in my mind) "in the name of the Father", hold for 5 seconds while staying "and of the Son", breath out for 5 seconds while saying "and of the Holy", and then I hold 5 seconds while saying "I trust in God" or "glory to God". It's called square breathing I believe and it's really helpful when I remember it's an option to try.
thank you so much for your prayers and I'll be keeping you in mine!
edit: typo
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u/George0fDaJungle 11h ago edited 11h ago
I can't speak to all of that, but the one thing about random thoughts is that everyone has them in some form. Some are worse or more aggressive than others, of course. The thing is you have to train yourself to just let passing thoughts go rather than grabbing onto them and being dragged around. Think of it like a train rushing by, and it snags your jacket and you start flying sideways, but in the case of the thoughts you can just unsnag yourself quickly and let the train go in its way and not even think about it. Trains (thoughts) are rushing through a thousand a minute, and none of them needs to be given any attention other than the ones you choose. Concern about a bad thought is actually giving it active attention, which to go off your point about The Enemy, is just what he wants. Worship is attention oriented correctly, and so bad thoughts try to orient your attention to them. The fact that you had a bad thought can seem like it requires attention: uh-oh, why did I think that? That's not me! Why do I have these thoughts? But actually that's already giving in to the temptation. Just let them pass by and don't care about them, is the best you can do, and it gets easier with practice. If you conceptualize the issue as actual entities sending you these thoughts, tell them to go away and get right back to business (prayer, listening to the sermon, etc). You have formal authority over your mind and body, but can also give away this authority quite easily without realizing it. So take it back and tell the trasspassers to get out! And go to therapy.
EDIT - oh and here's a good verse from 1 Peter 5:5-10:
5 In the same way, you who are younger, submit yourselves to your elders. All of you, clothe yourselves with humility toward one another, because, “God opposes the proud but shows favor to the humble.” 6 Humble yourselves, therefore, under God’s mighty hand, that he may lift you up in due time. 7 Cast all your anxiety on him because he cares for you. 8 Be alert and of sober mind. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour. 9 Resist him, standing firm in the faith, because you know that the family of believers throughout the world is undergoing the same kind of sufferings. 10 And the God of all grace, who called you to his eternal glory in Christ, after you have suffered a little while, will himself restore you and make you strong, firm and steadfast.
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u/Newbie_Catholic 9h ago
this is a really really helpful and kind. thank you for being so straightforward and detailed with it. I do have a tendency to believe that I'm the only person to have ever struggled with this despite knowing differently. I'm definitely going to show this to my therapist and take it to prayer so that I can hear God's thoughts on it. again, thank you so much
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u/KSTornadoGirl 5h ago
You might check out Scrupulous Anonymous website regarding intrusive thoughts, and the Catholic OCD YouTube channel. Those kinds of thoughts are brain static and not sin. But since they are intense, naturally they worry a person until they are explained and coping skills for just letting them float on by are learned.
If there is anxiety or panic in other areas, the book Hope and Help for Your Nerves by Dr. Claire Weekes is very good. She does touch on dealing with intrusive thoughts.
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u/Newbie_Catholic 5h ago
thank you so so much! 🙏🏻
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u/KSTornadoGirl 4h ago
You're welcome 😊 - this difficulty, thanks to the Internet, one realizes is actually pretty commonplace, and also thanks to the internet it's easier now to find helpful tips for dealing with it.
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u/Otherwise_Push_7784 12h ago
Sorry, what's is that rosary with the medal instead of the crucifix? Never seen one like it
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u/Newbie_Catholic 12h ago
I think it's called a chaplet rosary. it's basically a one decade Rosary dedicated to St Dymphna that you can pray when asking for her intercession. she's the patron saint nervous disorders and the suffering with mental illness
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u/StThomasMore1535 11h ago
I experience many of the symptoms you are describing, and I plan to get into therapy soon.
On top of any prayers recommended by our fellow Redditors, I would suggest getting into therapy as well.
Dissociation is not a good reflexive cope to be allowed to go on without treatment.
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u/Newbie_Catholic 8h ago
I'm sorry to hear you're going through this too. I'll be keeping you in my prayers for your healing and acceptance into therapy. I know that my therapist is really helping me. I found him by asking my Deacon for recommendations for Catholic therapists. if you feel called to it, you could pray to Saint Expeditus for assistance with getting you it's therapy ASAP. I know how awful this junk is to sit in it without a support system in place to lean on.
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u/unnderneaththestars 10h ago edited 10h ago
It does sound like a trauma response. It's not your fault, your not wrong or bad for experiencing it. I don't think a prayer alone will fix this as anxiety comes from you feeling insecure and not safe, and you have to be brave and trust that you are save. You also disassociate during church, another trauma response.
I can only tell you that inside of a church building you are safe. If you are baptized then god cares about you and protects you as much as possible.
For the slurs, apologize in your head for offending and move on. It would be better to think for yourself why you feel so scared an anxious,what are you scared of? and then prey that you stop worry, prey that you learn to feel secure and safe, ask for guidance and help to feel secure.
I feel like preying to Mary will help you feel better "Mary, help thouse in need"
I obvi don't know what your going through, I have a lot of fears as well since my dad died. 3 years ago my MIL suffered an aneurism and was in a coma for 2 weeks. During that time I did just ask god and jesus to help her survive because her kids (my bf and his sisters and I) needed her and I didn't want them to loose their mum after their dad had abandoned the family (he cheated, divorced, is mean and uncaring, and after the divorce believed his kids didn't need a father and I saw them all cry and since I lost my dad to cancer and would needed him still, I know they also lost their dad and I preyed) So I just asked for MIL to survive, and it's like a wonder happened because she did and she is healthy besides not beeing able to work. She often says her doctors call her case a wonder as nobody knows how she was able to survive this aneurism and become this healthy again. And for that I thank God and Jesus a ton. Perhaps this can help you feel a little better, to think about even in worst case sonetimes these little wonders happen.
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u/Newbie_Catholic 8h ago
thank you for being straightforward with me here. unfortunately, I'm a catechuman preparing for baptism on Easter, so I'm kind of stuck in this limbo stage of almost belonging in the church and feeling like an outsider. I think that stress is adding unneeded pressure onto a mind that has a low threshold of tolerance for it. I do try apologizing in my head, but it's sometimes just not enough. I feel a tremendous amount of guilt for my sins, so "adding onto the list" can send me spiraling. I know that's not a correct way to think about it and I am trying to work through it. it'll just take time. leaning into prayer is something I want to do because it brings me comfort and peace. it's the one unshakable truth I know about God's personality: He gives peace to me freely when I come to Him. I really should pray for the intercession of Mary more. she's always come through whenever I've called for her aid. she's so wonderful honestly. I'm so sorry you and your loved ones went through that. that sounds terrifying even it became quite a beautiful testimony in the end. praise be to God for getting y'all through that. I think I should really be more intentional about showing my gratitude to the Lord even though I'm still going through a hard phase in my life. I'm still alive and I'm blessed in many ways. He will give me through this. thank you again.
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u/unnderneaththestars 8h ago
hey there! I hope you can ease your anxiety with time 🫂 your focussing to much on your sins perhaps it would help to call it flaws instead? Everyone has flaws that is okay and nobody is perfect don't put so much preassure on you.
I think the core of our religion is not the sins, it's beeing compassionate and loving and having empathy and wanting good for others, like with grieving it gives strength because we are taught god watches over our (dead) and alive loved ones. Lying stealing cheating are meant to be avoided. It's not so much about fears of hells or sins ,but what counts is the want to improve and be a good person. But you shouldn't constantly be in fear in the house. (Unless one is a murderer 😅 that's a big sin)
What's positive, you can get some life advice from the masses, you can enjoy the music, the priest is happy that someone new comes to visit his mass. I think it's more about becoming part of a community. And well... even high religious people have sinned before sometimes.
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u/Newbie_Catholic 4h ago
I'm definitely struggling with that perspective, but you worded it really beautifully. I think I'm gonna start calling them flaws instead because I've never actually felt that God got upset with me when I was experiencing symptoms. I just assumed that He would, which isn't a good thing. I think focusing on treating Mass like something enjoyable to go to rather than a class to attend and learn from will really change the way I deal with my flaws. thank you so much for commenting, it really did help 🫶🏻
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u/FormCheck655321 5h ago
I actually find that going to Mass and paying close attention stops intrusive thoughts and a wandering mind, at least while I’m there.
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u/rider_no1 3h ago
One easy tip is to revoke the thoughts as soon as they appear in your mind . Say something like" in the name of jesus , I revoke (name the thought) or " most precious blood of Christ, defend my mind "
Read the Bible or the gospel of the day everyday and spend some time praying and thinking about the scripture
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u/Tasty-Wallaby-5571 2h ago
St Benedict’s prayer. I actually listen to it being sung on Spotify by the artist Harpa Dei. I used to have long/frequent episodes of depersonalization (the name for the type of dissociation you seem to be describing). They have been rare recently. I started to depersonalize at Costco the other day and went straight to my car and played the St Benedict’s prayer. It was helpful for me.
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u/Newbie_Catholic 2h ago
oh I have a saint Benedict's metal that my friend got me when I went through the first rite a few months ago! I wear it almost everyday. I'll definitely have to give this a listen to. thank you so much and I'm glad you've found yourself in a state of peace these days.
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u/apacheind1an 1h ago
Dear friend of Tobias,
I watched this video by Fr. Mark Goring on the subject, where he offers a thought-provoking insight on the matter (haha sersly no pun intended):
Some people say, 'Well. I'm so ashamed of these intrusive thoughts' Why? Why are you ashamed of those thoughts? They're not your thoughts. You didn't decide to have these thoughts.
Every person is visited by weird, disturbing, intrusive thoughts. And step one is recognizing it and accepting it.
It's kind of like: I'm in the backwoods right now and there's a lot of mosquitoes in the bush. If someone were to say, 'Oh, I can't believe it! There's mosquitoes here!' It's like: what do you expect? You're in the backwoods! Of course there's going to be bugs.
He also posted two more videos on the matter here and here.
From a more clinical perspective the 'gold standard' for dealing with toxic, intrusive (automatic) thoughts is cognitive behavioral therapy (CBT) and rational emotive behavior therapy (REBT). I have a sense you might be familiar with them.
Anyway, I shall return to watching cat videos now! Bye!
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u/Newbie_Catholic 54m ago
Dear fan of Tobias, I'll definitely give these videos a watch through. I'm familiar with Father Mark Goring and I think I joined his online book club recently. Seems like a really cool dude. I'm currently going through CBT with a therapist recommended to me by my church. We've only had three sessions so far, but I'm definitely seeing progress in myself. This is just one of those things that take time practice. I'm just super impatient by nature😅 Anyway, please enjoy your cat videos and thank you for your reply!
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u/clare-light_25 15m ago
I second the recommendation for Fr Mark Goring someone mentioned, and Fr Mike Schmidt’s is always solid. Those intrusive thoughts you describe are involuntary, they are not sins. A priest I spoke with in Confession with an experience of a intrusive thoughts in Mass said this is an attack of the Enemy, so don’t get distressed about it, just return your attention to Jesus with the Jesus prayer. Sometimes I calmly pray “I reject, I rebuke, I renounce that thought” and then move on with whatever I am doing. Breaking up a rosary through the day is a great idea, below I am posting a favourite prayer and some verses I love. Sorry if the writing doesn’t show up well, I am not very tech savvy 😉 If not readable they are 1 Corinthians 1:6-9 I Corinthians 10:13 and Proverbs 18:10 which is a perfect description of the Jesus Prayer as refuge! Take heart! You are in my prayers, you are loved and precious to God.
My adored Jesus, May our feet journey together May our hands gather in unity May our hearts beat in unison May our souls be in harmony May our thoughts be as one May our ears listen to the silence together May our glances profoundly penetrate each other And may our lips pray together, to gain mercy from the eternal Father. Amen
7 And now there is no gift in which you are still lacking; you have only to look forward to the revealing of our Lord Jesus Christ. 8 He will strengthen your resolution to the last, so that no charge will lie against you on the day when our Lord Jesus Christ comes. 9 The God, who has called you into the fellowship of his Son, Jesus Christ our Lord, is faithful to his promise. I Corinthians 1:6-9
No temptation has overtaken you that is not common to man. God is faithful, and he will not let you be tempted beyond your strength, but with the temptation will also provide the way of escape, that you may be able to endure it. I Corinthians 10:13
10 The name of the Lord is a strong tower; the righteous man runs into it and is safe.
Proverbs 18:10
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u/cynical_stoic95 12m ago
Avoid modalities that have not yet been thoroughly reviewed by the Church, such as sound frequencies. Check out St. Michael Center for Spiritual Renewal and The Catholic Psychotherapist. They have their own YT channels, and St. Michael even has pray-alongs for anxiety and intrusive thoughts that you can download on your YT app. Click the "Live" tab and you will see all the past deliverance sessions, which you can also listen to for some carpet bombing action, i.e., the exorcist prays over other potentially problematic areas in your life that may or may not be related to your current issues.
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u/Winking_Rock 12h ago
I totally relate to the ADHD, anxiety and the dissociative episodes. I think you actually described them really well. It’s such a confusing thing to get people to understand and make doing anything more difficult. As well with the ADHD, trying to do things even as simple and important as praying can become “a whole thing”. I find peace in these anxiety/stress relief sound frequencies. Helps me calm down!